Author Topic: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?  (Read 3837 times)

Guilmon1998

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I've been wondering if there will be any available incomplete or complete recording of the 1980 tour of COS or DM, apart from concerts at the Bridge House and the Technical College of the same year? i been very interested on this topic

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2015, 04:54:41 pm »
I haven't heard of any other recordings other than the two which are already available. The band may have some recordings, see this quote from Fletch in this interview at 1982-02-18 BBC Radio Stoke, UK:
Quote
Trevor: So you still have the tapes of some of the original material then?

Fletch: Yes. When we first started, we did concerts around people's houses in Basildon, that's before Dave joined, and it was quite good. One of the gigs we'd played, we played in front of 7 people and 10 teddybears. (laughter) And we dressed up in eh...

Dave: - pyjamas (giggles)

Fletch: pyjamas. It was just a good laugh. We still got the tape of that concert. We've done a lot of gigs around people's houses.
Of course, anything is possible, and I hope other recordings will surface some day.
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Ronny

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2015, 12:54:23 pm »
I think we´re really lucky to have those two, but I wouldn´t mind if some other would pop up.  :)

dmplus

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2015, 12:53:57 pm »
For a few weeks ago on eBay I saw a Basildon seller selling a MP3 copy of Composition of Sounds first concert at St Nicholas Comprehensive 1980. He claimed that he was the taper of the concert. So a friend of mine got in touch with him and managed to get a sample of the show (I also asked him but he never got a reply from him). It turned out to be a fake, a collection of random 1981 stuff.

Interestingly the same thread led to another local who stated that he had had the entire show taped. I have never bothered to ask him about the detail though. Mostly because there are so many fakes floating around and it's hard to tell which is real.

A few days later the PM3 copy was sold for less than 5 quid. lol

Oh another one I saw on US eBay the other day was a copy of an unknown gen recording from 1980/81 tour. It had a few unreleased songs (covers I think it was) and the seller claimed it to be real. Not sure what happened to that recording. Maybe someone here can shed some light on it?

So this was my first post on the Forum :)

/dmplus

discotraxxx

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2015, 05:27:52 pm »
Hi,

i already had a few discussions with various friends about this subject.

First, it is almost certain that most (if not all) the surfaced and unsurfaced tapes of the "early shows" (before the "Speak And Spell" tour) were made by a) the band b) friends or relatives of the band c) with permission by the venues.
If you study every single band from the 60's to the early 80's, this is always the case. With so many audience and "fans", with gigs played in sh*tholes (with all the respect to the great venues that helped CoS/DM at the start), only people related to the band could tape them. In the history there are only a few "mad" advanced tapers that taped soon-to-be famous bands (the best example in my opinion is "The Professor", the famous unknown taper who provided most of the complete and excellent audience sources for the Velvet Underground).

Now who are the people that may be interested into early live tapes ?

a) the band
In my opinion, Vince Clarke, who already made various demos, is a good candidate. Many bands used early live shows as demos (The Sisters Of Mercy, De/Vision, Front 242...).
Another good candidate is Martin. If i'm right, in one of the recent documentaries, he showed various memorabilia about the band in the early stages.
We know that Alan had many DM live shows taped over the years, but maybe someone had the same idea in the band / management in the first months.

b) friends or relatives
Girlfriends, friends, it seemed that some had early live tapes and demos.
Many bands had their first concerts taped by school friends or even their professors.

c) with permission by the venues
The Crocs soundboard tape is maybe a good example, if it wasn’t done for the band itself.

The Southend-On-Sea / Bridge House 1980 tapes are clearly taped by a someone that had a recorder in a proper location, the masters are probably excellent audience recordings.
We can’t hear a lot of disturbance by the audience.
More tapes were probably taped, the problem is to know if more survived in the hands of the band or their relatives…

There is good hope that old tapes may surface, many are still surfacing for other pop-rock bands each years.
The fact that Matt was able to find with the help of various collectors new variants of known sources of Southend-On-Sea and Birdge House tapes is quite positive.

See You

Vince
« Last Edit: September 12, 2015, 05:29:24 pm by discotraxxx »

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2015, 05:50:27 pm »
A few mislabeled tapes have passed through me as well, such as one labeled 1980-05-31 Basildon, containing 3 early live-only tracks from later recordings. There's one for 1981-05-16 London, obviously a mislabel (don't recall which gig it really was but it isn't an upgrade) and I think I have one of the highly-generated Crocs soundboard tapes mislabeled as 1981-04-11 or something.

Also, as mentioned in my first reply, Fletch recounts at least one gig that was taped, so there's a strong possibility of others having been taped as well, I think.

As seen in the "Making The Universe" documentary, Martin has some scrapbooks, but so far no scans or photos have been made available. The excellent Facebook group "Depeche Mode Classic Photos and Videos" was able to glean some information from that video, namely the setlist for 1980-09-20 Crocs.
Daryl Bamonte likely has similar setlist clippings / sheets etc as he provided some for the Bong magazine (see scans here). I've attempted to contact him via Facebook to see if he could help elucidate about those he provided for Bong magazine, but without any reply so far. I won't pester him any further.
Deb Danahay reports having some tapes, but understandably for sentimental reasons and distrust of the postal service to take proper care of the unique tapes, politely declined my offer to digitize her tapes for archival. I offered her a proper cassette deck as she was gifted one of those horrible "Ion Tape2PC" contraptions, but she declined that for the time being as well. I may offer my services again at a later time, suggesting a "test" of just one tape back and forth to gauge the results and the resulting sound quality of the transfer, and/or a serviced cassette deck for her own purposes. I would really prefer that she does not run through precious tapes through the Ion Tape2PC thing, because at best the resulting quality will be quite mediocre, and at worst the device may have a higher tendency to "eat" and mangle the tapes due to its garbage cheapo transport... She did also mention having a friend who can do the transfers too, but I've no idea what kind of equipment they have.
Finally, somebody on depmod had the 4-track Vince Clarke demo tape and shared 1-minute MP3 snippets, and somebody else on Facebook also had some other early demo tape, but both are understandably unwilling to share their tapes. The depmod guy seems to have disappeared from the Internet, or at least doesn't visit depmod any longer. I don't remember who the Facebook contact was, it seems I mistakenly deleted his messages from my history (stupid idea).

Still, the issue is that the band has never had an historian; nobody thought to document and record everything, so a lot of knowledge about the extremely early days is based on 35 year old memories, and unfortunately memories fade over time. I think that with the advent of the digital age and especially hard disk recorders, it is a reasonable assumption that most if not all of the gigs from 2001 and beyond were always recorded since the capability is there and hard drive space is cheap.

The more complete variant of the 1980 Bridge House recording was able to be created thanks to Ronny, who provided the mono source with overall more consistent sound quality with less distortion, and "Tora! Tora! Tora!" not found on the various LP and CD bootleg releases. Darkdevoted provided the tracks which weren't on the new source from his original pressing vinyl.
Also, there isn't really any way to confirm the two recordings we have from 1980 are accurate as far as date. We just have to trust the bootlegs.

One observation about the Crocs 1981 soundboard tape: it may look lossy based on its spectrogram, but in my opinion the eBay seller who provided the tape transfer applied significant noise reduction post-transfer. As seen on the tape inlay, Dolby B noise reduction was used when recording the 1st gen tape, but the seller probably did not use Dolby B during playback for whatever reason and opted for the destructive NR instead.

I also did attempt to contact the Institute of Contemporary Arts in London regarding any possible recordings they may have of Depeche Mode, but I was only able to contact their webmaster. He said he'd forward my inquiry to the proper person, but didn't guarantee a result. With no reply for a few months, I sent another email to see if the request was passed on, only to receive an automated message that another webmaster had replaced him. I gave up at this point. I wasn't aware of the 3-track FM broadcast from DM's performance on 1981-08-26 until it popped up on YouTube months later, and I was able to get a lossless MiniDisc version of that upload after several more months of emails back and forth with the taper and uploader. Unfortunately he doesn't have the tape any longer and it's in a friend's attic. He said he'd try to obtain it, but I haven't heard from him in eons. I sent another email a month or so ago, with no reply. I won't bother him any more about it.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2015, 06:30:43 pm by Towncivilian »
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Guilmon1998

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2015, 04:49:29 pm »
I am doubtful about the recording of technical college for many reasons:

1.- i don't think that the live sound changes in a short period from 30th October to 14th  November, is really short time to do a change of sounds
2.- "I Sometimes Wish I Was Dead" was played in the early dates of the 1981 tour three or two times and the title of the song on the early years was "Sometimes I Think I'm Dead"
3.- the songs sounds very similar to the gigs after the release of "Dreaming Of Me" and after the studio sessions of Photographic
4.- according to the info provided by Vince Clarke during an interview i did to him, Just Can't Get Enough was never played during the 1980 Tour, the band played the song at first time circa April or May of 1981       
« Last Edit: October 02, 2015, 04:52:14 pm by Guilmon1998 »

Ronny

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2015, 04:39:26 am »
A good friend of mine is a kind of expert on the early recordings and he also has his doubts about the recording from Technical College. In his opinion this is a 1981 show.

praskowitz

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Re: there will be a recording of the 1980 Tour available on the internet?
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2015, 08:41:04 am »
@ Guilmon1998 an Ronny

I think that the recordings dated on 30th October (Canning Town, Bridgehouse) and on 14th November (Southend on sea, Technical College) are not in any case played with an interval of only 15 days too.

There were too many changes in the sound and the structures of the songs.

I guess that the Technical Collage recording was from a later date, or the Bridgehouse - recording was earlier than 30th October; or something between these variations.

Maybe / probable the Bridgehouse - recording was one of the earliest live-performances with Dave.
- There were only a couple of people in the Audience; the handclapping sounds like no more than 20 people.
- The version of “Photographic” was very close to the known early Composition of Sound - demo tape version from Summer 1980
- “Ice Machine” has here the only known ending with the line “the ice machine - the ice machine” besides the demo tape
- The sound in general was very simple and monotonous. I guess this is the only recording, were they have probable used a drum machine instead of a backing tape, because of only here audible effect of the slowed down drums in the end of “Photographic”.
- Every song, which ‘survived’ until summer 1981, was played in a more or less totally different version. Only “Big Muff”, “Ice Machine” and “Tora! Tora! Tora!” sounded more close to the later live-versions.

The Technical Collage recording.

- Basically (apart from smaller changes) “Dreaming of me” and “Photographic” were in the final programming (structure), which were used until summer 1983 (end of “ABF”-Tour); “Tora! Tora! Tora!” and “Television Set”, has the programming, which were used until the end of the See you Tour in summer 1982
- “Big Muff” was the version, which was used until August 1981
- “Just can’t get enough” was played in this first version until June (or July) 1981; in any case until the beginning of the “summer tour” 1981, which has a constant setlist for the first time
- only “New Life” and “Ice Machine” were more close to the Bridghouse - recording, but more in the programming, than in the synth-sounds. Especially “Ice machine” sounds like the later version only with other drums and without the special Ice machine effects.
- I don’t know how long “Addiction” was played and how long or how many times “I sometimes wish I was dead” was played in these unfinished sounded versions.